A) MISINTERPRETING REVELATION 3:21 AND THE TWO DIFFERENT THRONES.

B) QUOTES IN THE BOOK OF REVELATION.

C) THE FIGHT FOR A CONCEPT.

D) OTHER TEXTS.

E) FROM MY FAVORITE BIBLE COMMENTATOR.

 

 

A) MISINTERPRETING REVELATION 3:21 AND THE TWO DIFFERENT THRONES

 

 

This Bible Study is really a result of people’s misinterpretation of Revelation 3:21.

 

Revelation 3:21:  “To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with Me in My throne, even as I also overcame, and Am set down with My Father in His throne.

 

According to this verse, each Deity has His Own throne.  According to Luke 1:32 & Acts 2:30, Christ’s throne is also called the throne of David, which according to Hebrews 12:2 & Colossians 3:1 (see also Mat. 26:64; Mark 16:19; Luke 22:69; Rom. 8:34; Heb. 1:3; 10:12; 12:2; 1Pe. 3:22), is at the right hand of God the Father.  Also, Hebrews Chapter One, verses 8 then 13, prove that God the Father has established a separate throne for Christ on the Father’s right hand.  That there is more than one throne, one for the Father, and one for the Son.

 

In Isaiah 6:1 we have “the LORD sitting upon a [one only for Him] throne.”  In Daniel 7:9-10 we have multiple thrones, but only “the Ancient [Aramaic, “attiyq,” applied only to Father God] of days” is mentioned as having His Own throne.  And when we go further to Daniel 7:13, we find Jesus approaching, but not on, the Father’s throne, with Daniel 7:14 having the Father giving Jesus “a kingdom” separate from the one in which the Father’s throne is in at that point.

 

Similarly, Jesus tells us that those who “overcometh will I grant to sit with Me in My throne,” meaning it can be dually occupied, just as each throne is dually occupied by the Godhead in Revelation 3:21, when Jesus is “set down with My Father in His throne.”  Now, if we are set down on Christ’s throne with Him, and He is set down with the Father upon His throne, where does that put us?  Before you come to the wrong conclusion, thinking we go with Christ to the Father’s throne, consider:

 

It is taught that we will sit on the Father’s throne because that is where Christ sits.  But I do not believe that is what this verse is teaching here; nor can it be supported by any other verses in the Bible (we will look at some below).  What I believe Christ is saying is that, “as I also overcame,” and therefore was granted the right to sit upon “[His] My Father’s throne,” so also, “To him that overcometh,” I will “grant to sit with Me in My throne,” which is again, His throne, and NOT the Father’s throne.  A study of the thrones in the Book of Revelation (see below) should bare this correct concept out.

 

Second Chronicles 18:18 is very clear, “I saw the LORD sitting upon His throne, and all the host of Heaven standing on His right hand and on His left.”  Notice, NOT ON His throne.  This verse is very helpful to prove that “on His right hand and on His left” hand is NEVER meaning one is ON the throne with Him.  In fact, this verse PROVES that to be on His right-hand or left-hand is NOT to be On His throne.

 

This is how my favorite Bible commentator puts it, by using the “NRSV” version:  “To the one who conquers I will give a place with Me on My throne, just as I Myself conquered and sat down with My Father on His throne.”  Revelation 3:21, NRSV.”  CTr:204; AA:543; DA:549; “Unlikely Leaders,” Page 198.  That makes it distinct that Christ has His throne and the Father has His throne.

 

A little common sense here.  Since no one can see the Father and live (Gen. 32:30; Lev. 16:13; Jud. 13:22; John 1:18; 1Jo. 4:12), what would make one think they could sit on the Fathers throne and live to tell of it?

 

Another from my favorite Bible Commentator, this statement is clear as to what would happen should we sit on the throne of the Father:  “I saw a throne, and on it sat the Father and the Son.  I gazed on Jesus’ countenance and admired His lovely Person.  The Father’s Person I could not behold, for a cloud of glorious light covered Him [see Lev. 16:13].  I asked Jesus if His Father had a form like Himself.  He said He had, but I could not behold it, for said he, if you should once behold the glory of His Person you would cease to exist [so let’s all go and sit on this throne; one time only of course].  Before the throne [NOT ON] I saw the Advent people, the Church [In a side note:  What is the difference between the Advent people and the Church?] and the world.  I saw a company bowed down before the throne [NOT ON IT], deeply interested.”  ExV:43; DS, March 14, 1846; Broadside1, April 6, 1846; And Others.

 

 

B) QUOTES IN THE BOOK OF REVELATION

 

 

Here are some quotes in the Book of Revelation:

 

1:4:  Even the “seven Spirits” are “before His throne,” and NOT ON it.

 

4:2:  Only God sits upon His throne, “One sat on the throne,” although Who this “One” is, is a supplied word, i.e., “One.”

 

4:3:  Therefore, we go to verse 3 to conclude that the “One,” i.e., the personality sitting upon this throne is Deity.

 

4:4:  Here we see that the “four and twenty elders” sit “round about the throne,” NOT ON it.  Are we of more redeemable value than these redeemed elders that we would venture to believe we are to sit upon the Father’s throne before they do [DON’T, CAN’T, WOULDN’T THINK OF DOING IT]?

 

4:5:  Even the “seven Spirits of God,” which is the “Holy Spirit,” according to Isaiah 11:2, are “before the throne,” NOT ON the throne.  WOW!

 

4:6:  Here we come closer to the truth, i.e., “in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne.”  How is it you are in the middle of the throne, yet NOT ON it, but being around it?  This is the true state of things which we may never understand until we get there.  But this is speaking of the “four beasts” and not the redeemed, for we all know that they will be “before the throne there was a sea of glass,” i.e., they are on the “sea of glass,” Revelation 15:12, NEVER upon God’s throne.  Also, according to Revelation 19:4, “the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that sat on the throne,” meaning they are NOT ON the throne either.

 

4:9:  However, in this verse (9), when the “beasts give glory” “to Him” that sits upon “the throne,” the One “who liveth for ever and ever,” meaning they are NOT giving “glory” to anyone else, only to the One “who liveth for ever and ever” receives this worship and is the Only One ON the throne.

 

4:10:  Even “The four and twenty elders fall down before,” the throne, NOT ON the throne, falling down before “Him that sat on the throne [Who sits ON the throne], and worship Him,” casting “their crowns before the throne,” meaning they are NOT ON the throne.

 

5:1:  Only God is sitting upon the throne.

 

5:6:  Refer to Revelatin 4:6 to remember that the redeemed are ON the “sea of glass” and [here in this verse; and also they are there in 4:6) “the four beasts,” are “in the midst of the throne,” while, “in the midst of the elders,” we must remember that these “elders” are “round about the throne,” Revelation 4:4, NOT ON it, and that “the four beasts” worship the One on the throne (Rev. 19:4).

 

5:7:  Only Jesus is allowed to approach the Father Who sits “upon the throne.”  Jesus, “came and took the book out of the right hand of Him [the Father] that sat upon the throne.”  No one else is sitting there; for:

 

5:11:  Everyone is “round about the throne,” NOT ON it.

 

5:13:  In this verse every entity that is created worships, “Him that sitteth on the throne;” meaning they are NOT ON it.

 

6:16:  Even the unrighteous acknowledge this fact, that NO ONE SITS UPON the throne except, “Him that sitteth on the throne.”

 

7:9:  Even the “great multitude” who are redeemed, these would be included in our questionable verse in Revelation 3:21, are “before the throne, and before the Lamb,” and NOT ON the throne.

 

7:10:  Here the “great multitude” of verse 9 praise “God which sitteth upon the throne;” meaning they are NOT ON the throne.

 

7:11:  Even “the angels” stand “round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and” fall down and worship “before the throne,” NOT being themselves ON the throne.

 

7:15:  And these same angels stay “before the throne of God,” NOT ON “the throne of God.”

 

7:17:  Jesus is “in the midst of the throne.”  None are mentioned as being with Him; although allowed to be on His throne with Him according to our misunderstood verse, 3:21, but not the Fathers.

 

8:3:  Again, even our prayers are, “before the throne,” NOT ON the throne.  Leviticus 16:13 is very helpful here:  “And he shall put the incense upon the fire before the LORD, that the cloud of the incense may cover the Mercy Seatthat is upon the testimony, that he die not.”  How much clearer can we get?  You will “die” if you attempt to look upon the Father, let alone attempt to SIT UPON the throne with God.  What would make you think you can SIT UPON the Father’s throne with Him when you are not even to behold Him?

 

12:5:  Here Jesus is ON the throne of God, because He overcame, see our Revelation 3:21 again.

 

14:3:  Here we can learn that the “forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth,” are “before the throne,” NOT ON the throne.  How much clearer can it get BY NOW that they are NOT ON the throne?

 

14:5:  Again, the “forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth,” of verse 3, are “before the throne,” NOT ON the throne.

 

16:17:  Here there comes “a great voice,” this being Jesus if you agree, “from the throne,” Jesus [God] being ON the throne, for no other voice comes from there.  This “great voice” states, “It is done.”  Only Jesus [God] makes this statement, here in this verse, and in Ezekiel 39:8, and is clearly identified in Revelation 21:6 as being Jesus.

 

19:4:  Here again “the four and twenty elders” fall down BEFORE the throne and “worshipped God that sat on the throne.”  Who sits ON the throne?

 

19:5:  In verse 16:17, we have “a great voice” coming out of the throne, which I believe to be God’s [Jesus’] voice; but here we have “a voice.”  This “voice” is not identified specifically and may be classified with our dilemma of verses 4:6 & 5:6 & 7:17, in that it comes “out of the throne,” possibly meaning it is, “in the midst of the throne,” and possibly not ON the throne.

 

20:11:  Herein is the “great white throne” that you dare to sit upon.  You determine if this is one and the same “throne” that God sits on, “Whose face the earth and the Heaven fled away.”

 

21:5:  Here Jesus is sitting “upon the throne” and John is NOT sitting with Him.  You might say it is because John is not redeemed yet; but then explain why the 24 elders are not ON It.  Yes, one day we will sit with Jesus on His throne -- according to our verse in discussion, Revelation 3:21 -- however, we will NOT SIT ON the Father’s throne.

 

22:1:  All things are sustained via the “river of water of life,” because of Him Who sits upon “the throne of God,” i.e., “the throne of God and of the Lamb.”  The “throne of” WHO?  You might say the Fathers throne, for both Jesus and the Father can sit there together (Rev. 3:21).  However, that does NOT PUT YOU ON the throne.

 

22:3:  This verse seems to make it clear to me that “the throne of God and [the throne] of the Lamb” are now on the earth, and we who are NOT ON the throne “shall serve Him.”  Who is ON the throne forever and ever?  The meaning once again is that we are NOT ON the throne.

 

 

C) THE FIGHT FOR A CONCEPT

 

 

To be fair, proponents use other verses to support their belief that we will sit where Satan wanted to usurp and sit [This is the real reason I am fighting this concept.  Satan wanted this position which only God should have].  I agree that we (I) should not base a doctrine or belief upon only “one” verse, therefore let’s explore the theologians reasoning for being able to sit where only the Father sits.

 

They go to Ephesians 1:20, where God “set Him [Jesus] at His Own right hand in the Heavenly places,” which to me COULD place Jesus ON the Father’s throne, but it does NOT place you on that throne; and it DOES place Jesus on the throne on the “right hand” throne next to the Father’s throne.  They have to misuse Revelation 3:21 again to get to the concept that Christ is on the same throne; which I have no problem with; just, of course, us then sitting there with both of them.  Then they go to Ephesians 2:6, which states:  “and made us sit together in Heavenly places in Christ Jesus [or better, “because of Christ Jesus”].”  That we sit “together” were Jesus is I agree.  But without misinterpreting Revelation 3:21, this verse does not put us ON ANY throne, but only “in Heavenly places.”  This verse becomes a far stretch to use it in order to put anyone ON any throne.

 

In another example, Jesus is approached by the mother of John and James (see Mat. 20:20-23) and asks if either can be granted to sit on His right and left hand (Notice, NOT ON the throne; although that is assumed by the mother).  Jesus doesn’t correct her and tell her about Revelation 3:21, which would let her know that they and others will all be sitting on the throne with Him.  But He does do something informative for us all, in that He acknowledges that there is a right-hand spot and a left-hand spot upon His throne, and the Father has ultimate control and decision over that position (the position of Jesus’ throne; the Fathers throne is not in question here).  Apparently, the moral of all of this discussion is that the Deity [Jesus] is unselfish and allows personages to sit upon His throne with Him.  This excludes the Father’s throne; for no one sees the Godhead (Father:  Lev. 16:13) and lives.  And if we go back in time, nor did anyone see Jesus upon His throne, Who was in His complete Divine form at that point in time (see Exo. 33:20).

 

 

D) OTHER TEXTS

 

 

Let’s look at other Bible texts that speak specifically towards the Deity and their thrones.

 

In First Samuel 2:8 it is stated, “to make them inherit the throne of glory,” inferring that this must be the inheritance of the saints, i.e., sitting with Jesus, as Revelation 3:21 concurs.  Again, Second Chronicles 18:18 confirms what I have pointed out above, i.e., “I saw the LORD sitting upon His throne, and all the host of Heaven standing on His right hand and on His left.”  Notice again, NOT ON His throne.  This verse is very helpful to prove that “on His right hand and on His left” hand is not always meaning one is ON the throne with Him.  In fact, this verse PROVES that to be on His right-hand or left-hand is NOT to be On His throne.

 

Psalm 9:4 (see also Psa. 9:7; 11:4; 97:2; Isa. 16:5) has God judging from His throne.  I see no one else deserving of this service.  Only God is the True Judge.  Isaiah 6:1 has God sitting upon “a throne,” which is inconclusive.  Isaiah 14:13 proves my point about Satan and us not desiring more than what God has granted us.  In Isaiah 66:1 we have an interesting twist to this entire discussion, in that God states that all “Heaven is My throne.”  This statement is revisited again in Acts 7:49.  This might be the explanation we are looking for in order to explain how all the redeemed can sit on Christ’s throne, but not, THE THRONE of THE FATHER.

 

However, continuing on, according to Jeremiah 3:17, Jerusalem shall be called “the throne of the LORD.”  This would coincide with Isaiah 66:1, in that a large area comprises God’s throne.  Jeremiah 17:12 is in descriptive of location, but has us having our own thrones (NOT God’s throne).  According to Jeremiah 49:38, God will set up His throne over concurred, or unrighteous people; again, a large area.

 

Ezekiel 1:26 appears to be a vision of our Lord upon His throne; although, if we consider the wording, it is only a “likeness of a throne,” as also found in Ezekiel 10:1.  Ezekiel 43:7 has God’s throne AMONG His people forever. That however, does not put you On His throne.

 

According to Daniel 7:9, “His throne was like the fiery flame.”  Good luck sitting on this one.  Most likely it only devours unrighteousness.  According to Zechariah 6:13 Jesus “shall sit and rule upon His throne; and He shall be a Priest upon His throne.”  Who’s throne is it?  Jesus tells us in Matthew 5:34, that “it is God’s [the Father’s]” [Who’s] throne,” which is once again, very large, i.e., all of “Heaven.”  But you do not SIT ON it.

 

Matthew 19:28 is very clear that we have thrones separate from our Lord’s:  “the Son of man shall sit in the throne of His glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones,” and therefore not sitting ON His throne, but separate thrones of your own.  In Matthew 22:44; Mark 12:36; Luke 20:42; Acts 2:34:  “The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit Thou on My right hand.”  This again, does NOT include you!!!

 

Matthew 25:31-33:  “[31] When the Son of man shall Come in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then shall He sit [He sits, NOT you yet] upon the throne of His glory: [32] And before Him [NOT with Him yet] shall be gathered all nations:  and He shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: [33] And He shall set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left.”  Not ON the throne; but ON His “right hand.”  However, this is redemptive language, and not meaning physically active.  For the unrighteous will not be in Heaven on Christ left-hand.

 

Matthew 26:64:  “Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of power [the Father’s “power;” possibly upon His throne], and Coming in the clouds of Heaven.”  Not ON the throne; but ON His “right hand.”

 

Mark 14:62:  “And Jesus said, I Am: and ye shall see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of power [the Father’s “power;” possibly upon His throne], and Coming in the clouds of Heaven.”  Not ON the throne; but ON His “right hand.”

 

Luke 22:69:  “Hereafter shall the Son of man sit on the right hand of the power of God [the Father’s “power;” possibly upon His throne].”  Not ON the throne; but ON His “right hand.”

 

According to Luke 1:32 (see also Acts 2:30) Jesus inherits the throne of David [i.e., ruler over the righteous] which is given to Him by His Father; meaning the Father has a throne and Jesus has a throne.  Considering Hebrews 4:16:  “Let us therefore come boldly unto [or “before,” not ON; granted this is speaking of prayer and not a dwelling place] the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.”  This verse is before we get to Heaven and NOT IN Heaven.  Don’t attempt to use this verse with Revelation 3:21 please.

 

Hebrews 8:1 (see also Hebrews 12:2) again teaches us that the Father has a throne and Jesus has a throne, of which Jesus sits apart from:  “We have such an High Priest, Who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty.”

 

Lastly, Revelation 1:4 is interesting, in that, “the seven Spirits which are before His throne,” has One Personage upon God’s throne with the Holy Spirit [see Isa 11:2 again] being around it.

 

Apparently, there are reasons for more than One Deity being upon a throne, and there are reasons for only One Deity being upon a throne, and there are reasons for the saints and any others for being upon Christ’s throne with Him and being around Jesus’ throne (or right-hand and left-hand).  But in my understanding, only the Deity sits upon the Fathers throne.  NO created beings can be there nor survive there.  Jesus approaches there for us.  We do not approach there except through Jesus.  AND, as Satan attempts (and attempted) to do, we should NEVER dare to sit there.

 

 

E) FROM MY FAVORITE BIBLE COMMENTATOR

 

 

“They knew that they had a Representative in Heaven, an Advocate at the throne of God.”  AA:35.

 

“The one who stands nearest to Christ [NOT ON His throne] will be he who has drunk most deeply of His spirit of self-sacrificing love.”  CC:314.

 

“The most exalted of the redeemed host that stand before the throne of God and the Lamb, clad in white, know the conflict of overcoming, for they have come up through great tribulation.”  CET:190; 5T:215.  NOTICE, when our Bible Commentator brings the Fathers throne into the picture, “the redeemed” only “stand before the throne.”

 

“How can those who expect to stand around Christ’s throne, and to be clothed with His righteousness, distrust God, and fear that He will leave them to come to want?”  SD:234.

 

“Revelation 3:21.  The one who stands nearest to Christ [Where is “The one,” i.e., you?  NOT ON the throne] will be he who has drunk most deeply of His spirit of self-sacrificing love -- love that moves the disciple to labor and sacrifice even unto death for the saving of humanity.”  From Trials to Triumph, Page 285; ST, January 22, 1902; DA:549; CC:314; AA:543.

 

“Revelation 3:21.  We can overcome.  Yes; fully, entirely.  Jesus died to make a way of escape for us, that we might overcome every fault, resist every temptation, and sit down at last with Him in His throne.”  YRP:367; OHC:353; 4bSG:29; 1T:144; RH, September 4, 1883.  Again, NOT ON the Fathers throne.

​